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Old 01-09-2009, 11:03 AM   #41 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

My Fodder who art on Tan Talk:

Relevancy is relative eh? Not relative to your mind set, relative to mine. I can’t make a blanket statement that only my way of thinking is relevant as you do. I respect your opinions though and enjoy reading them.

History is only relevant if a society learns from it. Guns are extremely relevant to our present culture obviously, because there is so much controversy about them. Gangstas have em, Sports Super Stars shoot themselves in the leg with them at bars, Vice Presidents shoot their friends with them on hunting trips, and target shooting is even a recognized Olympic Sport. There is a gun culture in our society and that is relative and relevant today in my opinion.

Religion in your opinion may not be relevant to you; however there are millions of us who believe that our right to believe in a philosophy is very relevant to modern culture. Any Bible scholar knows that the references you claim to be contradictory are simply God’s instructions on how to manifest His ‘vengeance.’ The Talmud refers to this passage from Exodus in the context of equitable compensation. Much like an insurance policy says they will pay $1000.00 for the loss of an eye. In the past that might have equaled five sheep or a ram, not necessarily an actual eye or tooth. God uses his subjects to exact

His vengeance, from the Latin vindicare to lay claim to, avenge. You contradict your contradiction by saying there are laws that would be contradictory to those handed down by the founding fathers, because those laws were based on the founders’ spiritual beliefs. Read the Federalist Papers etc. The founders purposely neglected to directly address slavery thus allowing it.

In Bible times, slavery was more of a social status. People sold themselves as slaves when they could not pay their debts or provide for their family. In New Testament times, sometimes doctors, lawyers, and even politicians were slaves of someone else. Some people actually chose to be slaves so as to have all their needs provided for by their master.

Man enslaved man, because God gave man freedom of choice. Even in “modern” times there are forms of slavery, illegal? Yes. Women and children in the Old Testament don’t seem to be treated differently than today. There were many women heroes such as Ruth, Deborah, and some that would be soap opera characters today. Jesus showed a great love of children and treated women equally. Everyone must get stoned.

The Change Thing: I agree with you except I do recognize my abilities at discernment and my religion approves and encourages that.

Context: I did see the whole tape of the, what was said before and after, and it was very inflammatory in my opinion. My digging shows a history of his using the past to incite racial passions in the “modern” context of his sermons. His white counterpart did the same thing in his church when he was putting Hillary down. It is government of the people by the people right? Some race activist won’t let the past go and work on the now.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdJB-qkfUHc
Bang! Your it.

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Old 01-09-2009, 08:49 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Not relevant to the current conditions, but not irrelevant in and of itself. People in this country have not had to go out and shoot their meals for decades now. An armed revolution in this country today is presoterous. I fully the support the self-defense argument for gun ownership though.

I don't think I said religion was irrelevant. If I did, I meant that it was irrelevant in regards to the objections of the righteous to Barak Obama as president because of his political stands, even though they may run somewhat contrary to his own spiritual and personal beliefs and morals. As for slavery and the treatment of women and children, in the bible these practises are justified by the Word of God. But in our modern day society, rational people do not approve of people being the "property" of others and abused or forced to labor without compensation. It is irrelevant that there are cultures around the world that still practice this legally, and often illegaly, to the principle notion. And with that many people talking to God and trying to remember and write down what He said, it's not surprising that there are a few contradictions here and there.

Semantics - there is the meaning of the words, and the "spirit" or thrust of the message. I suppose there are many interpretations for what Wright and Michelle said. So be it. But I object to the conservative media taking a short sound byte, out of context, and misinterpreting the spirit of the message intentionally for the sole purpose of manipulating the public's perception of Barak Obama. I don't approve when the liberal media does the same thing to republican figures - like the " ... 100 year war with Iraq" thing they did to McCain. What he said was that he would see the mission through to the end, if it takes a hundred years (not a verbatim quote, just the spirit of the message he was communicating).

~Nice serve! Time to volley~
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Old 01-10-2009, 09:14 PM   #43 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Volley well then:

Why didn't you say that in the first place? Sheesh!

I remember I actually had to take Civics in Jr. High. Teacher stepped on my hand while I was pretending to pick up a pencil so I could look up some girls dress. That was a value lesson for sure.

Do they still teach Civics in school or is that too conservative a subject? Other than this thread I really can't find any other intellectuals debating anything.

Let's explore this premise. I prefer a Republic vs a Democracy. I fear the SCOTUS oligarchy. They ignore the Constitution and use International Law as precedent. They feel that they are the law of the land.

"After having taken each individual, in turn, into his powerful hands and moulded them in his own way, the sovereign reduces each nation into nothing more than a herd of timid and hard working animals of which the government is the shepherd."
-- Alexis de Tocqueville, De la Démocratie en Amérique (1840)

Are we sheep or cows? I know some rats for sure. What kind of jobs is our new president going to create? I can't see 4 million people leaning on shovels or maybe I can. We have a legislator here in the live long drag of the dreadful day in the land where the villainous sun holds sway that is introducing a change to a law changing the age a teenage can tan with their parent's permission from 14 to 16 and adds some language about the permission form they have to sign.

A teenage girl can have an abortion without informing her parents in Florida, but this guy wants to prevent her from tanning, why? Health concerns; she might get cancer. The rest of the legislature is looking for ways to balance the budget; mostly cutting funds for education. It isn't no child left behind anymore it is no school left standing. But, we have Power Ball now. Where does that money go?

Back to the animal comparison:

From the cow's point of view, their master seems exceptionally kind and benevolent. Not only are all the comforts provided, most of the cows would argue that they have plenty of freedom. Most of the time they are allowed to roam a rather large pasture at their will. Of course, the pasture does have a fence around it and there are those disturbing instances when they are locked up in pens for awhile, but even that is usually for their own good. Strangely, some cows don't like the fence and are constantly probing for its weaknesses. Such cows, when found out, find that there are severe consequences for such probing. All in all it is a good life, not much to complain about really. Until one day, it suddenly becomes obvious why they have been so well cared for. But by then it is too late!

A deer on the other hand has no medical care, it has to find its own food and it has to provide for its own security. In return for its independence, about the only thing it gets, for sure, is . . . freedom! But the price is high. It has to find its own food, provide for its own security, has to settle its own disputes, and has to find its own shelter.

From the cows point of view, the deer is a fool to give up so much just for freedom. Who needs freedom anyway? What good is it?
It is not obvious. The benefits are subtle but they are significant. First, physically and mentally, the deer is superior to the cow. It has to be to survive. It doesn't rely on drugs and medical care for its health as the cow does. Surviving on its own has resulted in it being graceful, strong, fast, intelligent, and very alert. Second, it enjoys the variety and wonder of nature. Unlike the cow, it doesn't have to look at the same terrain every day.

It is smart enough to know it can jump fences (Cows can too, they just don't know it. In a crisis, some discover they can). Third, the deer's life is exciting. The cow's life is dull, dull, dull. The deer would not trade places with the cow and if it were somehow provided with all the cow's benefits but with the fence, would try to escape.

It is like we entrepreneurs compared to the bureaucrats. They are the cows, we are the deer. Legislators and government workers feed the cows while we roam the forrests of free enterprise. Well, as the cows say, "eat more chicken."
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Old 01-10-2009, 11:27 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Great post! The only thing I would add to the analogy is that the American populace are, in my opinion, like sheep, with the American government being less like shepherds and more like pimps. Keep the flock under control and growing wool to harvest.
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Old 01-12-2009, 10:54 AM   #45 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

BAAAAHHHH BAAAHHHHHHHHH
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Old 01-12-2009, 11:46 AM   #46 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Just Curious:

what do you all think about this:

Pass the DREAM Act - Support Higher Education for All Students
The problem: Many American students graduate from college and high school each year, and face a roadblock to their dreams: they can't drive, can't work legally, can't further their education, and can't pay taxes to contribute to the economy just because they were brought to this country illegally by their parents or lost legal status along the way. It is a classic case of lost potential and broken dreams, and the permanent underclass of youth it creates is detrimental to our economy. Former Republican Sen. Orrin Hatch has said: “In short, although these children have built their lives here, they have no possibility of achieving and living the American dream. What a tremendous loss for them, and what a tremendous loss to our society.”

The solution : The federal DREAM Act (Development, Relief, and Education for Alien Minors Act), is a bipartisan legislation that would permit these students conditional legal status and eventual citizenship granted that they meet ALL the following requirements:
--if they were brought to the United States before they turned 16, are below the age of 30,
--have lived here continuously for five years,
--graduated from a U.S. high school or obtained a GED
--have good moral character with no criminal record and
--attend college or enlist in the military.

Why should you care? There is no other pathway to citizenship for these students. Besides the injustice of punishing children for the alleged transgressions of their parents, throwing away the talent we have invested in from K-12 and accruing losses in human and financial capital by deporting talented students is bad public policy. The Social Security Administration has recently stated that we need a net increase of 100,000 immigrants each year to ensure Social Security solvency. Passing the DREAM Act would actually help solve the Social Security crisis by creating a larger taxable base of educated Americans that are already in the United States. It would also free some of the backlog that currently plagues the legal immigration system. Also, the DREAM Act in its latest form, does not grant in-state tuition to any student.

Endorsements: Since 2001, almost a 1000 organizations have officially endorsed the bill. Barack Obama has stated that DREAM Act beneficiaries are “American children for all intents and purposes” and has called this a top priority.

Tell President-Elect Obama to pass the DREAM Act in 2009. See DreamActivist.org to get more involved.

source http://www. change. org/ideas/view/p...dream_act_now.
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Old 02-07-2009, 08:18 AM   #47 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Here is your GD America statement:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nH5ixmT83JE

More good stuff From Rev. Wright:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vdJB-...eature=related


I can't beleive that you would try to down play this P.O.S....
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Old 02-07-2009, 09:48 AM   #48 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Yeah, God Dam america and it's pathetic attempt at being #3 for the past 8 years.

What's the problem?
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Old 02-07-2009, 10:01 AM   #49 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Amen!
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Old 02-07-2009, 10:05 AM   #50 (permalink)
 
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Re: Civics 101 - "Change"

Rule #1.

DO THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF A "HUMAN" THAT WOULD COVER MORE THAN 1/3 OF THEIR BUMPER WITH A PERMANENT STICKER.
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