Let's argue politics ... - Page 31

mr belvedere · 07-04-2008, 04:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ezliving_Jim

Top Reasons to Elect McCain

1. Taxes won't be raised as much by McCain. Advantage McCain.
-George the father said he wasn't going to mess with taxes; turned it out it later to be necessary, but it helped to get him elected. But it doesn't matter: congress "changes taxes", the president only approves or denies the changes.
Advantage: politics

2. SCOTUS - next 3 Justices will be nominated by the next President. Advantage McCain.
-This opinion assumes that Obama would nominate otherwise "bad" judges to the court. I believe he would nominate "honest judges with integrity" over judges that could be counted on to vote the way their appointer wanted them to.
Advantage: Obama

3. What's better?: 1 political party running everything, House, Senate and Executive Branch or to have 2 party representation? 2 party government. Advantage McCain.
-Yes, one political party running everything would be better than the stalemate and utter unproductiveness (is that even a word?) that we have been strapped with since the country sent the message to Washington that majority of voters are done with the "Republican" tack by electing a majority Democrat party congress and senate (not sure if the Dems have a majority in the senate, but I know it's close).
Advantage:Obama

4. Leadership: Advantage McCain.
-Come on, Jim, on what grounds? Sure, McCAin was an officer in the Navy, but he wasn't a leader of people, an administrator of a suborganization (flight, squadron, air group, etc). Who did he ever inspire or supervise? Obama worked as a community organizer: inspirer and administrator.
Advantage: Obama

5. Wartime President. Advantage McCain.
-Uh, what? Come again? I served in the Marine Corps Reserves for 8 years: Vote Mr. Belvedere for wartime president? No new taxes! Corporate windfall profits for all corporates! Keep your guns! We'll kill every enemy that deserves it! We won't talk to any loser country or Org we don't like! $1.99/gal gas!!! ~Don't you just love America? You can say just about anything that doesn't make any sense and get away with it! Thank you First and Second amendments!~
Advantage: None

6. 2nd Amendment. Advantage McCain.
Advantage: Status Quo under Senator McCain
Advantage: Positive Change under Senator Obama

7. Liberal or Conservative? Conservative. Advantage McCain.
-Can you really label Senator McCain as either? ~Not honestly I don't think~ He certainly doesn't toe the party line, does he? I think he just drifts with the political winds, and says the words, like so many other "politicians" that need the party affiliations to advance their political "careers". Free-thinking, "good of the people" people with political aspirations with any brain in their heads will never run as "independent". Remember Joe Lieberman? We are by no means a "conservative" culture, by any stretch of the definition. Read up on some history and you'll find that the two political parties used be opposite if each other and their current "foundations" of today. ~I can't wait for the Whigs to return to power! They were some conservative mother****ers right there! Lincoln was their POTUS!~
Advantage: Obama

8. Smaller or bigger government? Smaller. Advantage McCain.
-Bull ****. Government "size" isn't going to change one iota under either candidate! Jim, seriously, what has McCain said we would do away with if elected? I'll hold off on this one for a while until you've had more time to make some more **** up.
Interim advantage: Government

9. Healthcare for illegal aliens? No. Advantage McCain.
-Uh, yeah, let the illegal ****ers suffer! I'm actually all for this! I have to pay for ****ing insurance or pay cash for services, so should every other *** hole out there! As a matter of fact, all of the god ****** legal losers need to start paying for their own ****, too! You can't? Then die, *****, twitchin' on the floor of the ER lobby while the rest of us just watch! I don't care if you are a stinking, worthless human being with one or more people that love and/or care about you! If they loved and/or cared about you, they would have been there with you! hehe Yeah, **** the illegal Mexican sons a *****es!. They don't even count as people! lol
Advantage: Capitalism/Conservatism
Disadvantage: Humanity

10 Experience. Advantage McCain.
- Experience with what, exactly? ~That's what I thought~
Advantage: Obama

There's more. This was just done fast.

I really can't wait to see the rest, after you've had more time to assemble a "bullet-proof" argument for why Senator John "I signed a confession to being a war criminal and wrecked several million dollars worth of military hardware" McCain is more "qualified" to lead our nation as president for the next 4-8 years.

unity · 07-04-2008, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Smith

The "good news" is that no matter who wins, it will be an improvement (no way either one could be worse) over Steve and Jim's favorite president.

Call me a dreamer but I still think that HRC has an "outside chance" to get the nomination and, if she does, she will be the next president. I'm pinning my hopes on the "dirt" that is bound to come out of the Rezko scandal.

Happy 4th of July and be comforted by the fact that it is the last in GWB's presidency.

Wait, what? Obama already got the nomination as far as anyone else is concerned. Although I am betting she will be on the ticket. I think the campaign is wanting a cooling off period and time for Obama to express himself instead of making it look like "Obama had to put her on the ticket to win". I think the campaign wants to pull out as far ahead as possible then drive the final nail in the McCain coffin. Actually, that may be literal :) 74, really? <sigh>

tanfixr · 07-04-2008, 10:26 AM

You guys still muddle issues where it's not necessary.

1)Taxes - Obama is pro tax increases and redistribution of wealth. No debate there.

2)SCOTUS - if you want "honest" liberal judges with integrity, who are inclined to apply liberal views and European law to the Constitution, Obama has the advantage. If not, McCain has the advantage. No legitimate debate there.

3) Pure politics - debatable

4) Leadership - nuanced perspective. Leadership is subjective, however, experience is not.

5) Wartime... Duh, Obama is very anti-military establishment. No debate there.

6) 2nd Amendment. Uhhh, this has been settled. It's not really an Executive branch issue beyond support of Congressional action. On pure principle of supporting the Constitution though, advantage McCain. If you don't like the 2nd Amendment, advantage Obama.

7) Liberal/ Conservative. Duh, Obama is rated by Liberal mags as the most Liberal Senator in the Senate, with an even more Liberal voting record than Kennedy. If you want to try the French experiment, advantage Obama. If not, advantage McCain.

8) Big Government. Another Duh. If you want a push for more govenment social programs, advantage Obama, if not advantage McCain.

9) Healthcare - Emergency healthcare is always available to everyone, illegal or not. Drama isn't necessary in the debate. "FREE" healthcare is NOT a right - advantage McCain, unless you believe it is.

10) Experience - I don't even think Obama tries to argue this one. His argument is "youth vs. experience".

unity · 07-04-2008, 10:36 AM

Im just wondering what would happen when McCain dies in office, assuming he gets there. After the first term he would be near 80. So anyone pro-McCain needs to also look closely at his running mate. Its bad enough he has the first stages of alzheimer.

Don Smith · 07-04-2008, 11:14 AM

The question is, who "flip-flops" more, Obama or McCain?

Neither of them have a real "core" to sustain them.

Some questions for you Obama fans.

Does he "stand for" what he said in the primaries or what he is now saying?

Does anyone (including him) really know what he will do if he is elected?

The "safer" choice (and I'll have to hold my nose if I am forced to vote for him) is McCain but the "best choice" for the country is HRC.

Another question. Does anyone think that Obama would have won the primary if he had said what he is saying now?

Ezliving_Jim · 07-04-2008, 02:39 PM

There is Hope For America.

If Don Smith is even considering voting for McCain, there is Hope For America.

It is fantastic that everything that comes out of Obama's mouth is being recorded.

Depending on who Obama is standing in front of, that will determine the position he takes on a given issue. In the last 24 hours, Obama wouldn't shut up about the Iraq War and ended up with 3 different positions.

He has at least that many positions already on the 2nd Amendment.

An apple has more "core" than Obama.

Hope For America!

Ezliving_Jim · 07-04-2008, 02:54 PM

mr belveder, your responses to my quick 10 point pro-McCain list are so absurd, so illogical that they can't even qualify as debating points. Still, your vote counts.

I hope you live in a dominate strong Blue State. Please don't move your vote to a Red State.

Don Smith · 07-04-2008, 05:28 PM

Message to Steve and Jim:

Don't blame me, I voted for Gore and Kerry.

mr belvedere · 07-05-2008, 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ezliving_Jim

mr belveder, your responses to my quick 10 point pro-McCain list are so absurd, so illogical that they can't even qualify as debating points. Still, your vote counts.

I hope you live in a dominate strong Blue State. Please don't move your vote to a Red State.

Ok, I can respect your opinion on that, but tell me where I'm wrong with those responses in your view. Or anybody else for that matter that feels as Jim does about my responses - I want to hear what you think. But please, don't just discount what somebody says on this thread because it runs counter your own positions - provide some feedback, please.

engfant · 07-05-2008, 10:27 AM

I'm not totally against McCain. He's 8 years late though. He's the one that should have been in charge on 9-11-01 not limpie bush.

07-04-2008, 10:26 AM	#303 (permalink)
tanfixr Join Date: Aug 12 2002 Location: Michigan Age: 44 Posts: 318 Rep Power: 7	Re: Let's argue politics ... You guys still muddle issues where it's not necessary. 1)Taxes - Obama is pro tax increases and redistribution of wealth. No debate there. 2)SCOTUS - if you want "honest" liberal judges with integrity, who are inclined to apply liberal views and European law to the Constitution, Obama has the advantage. If not, McCain has the advantage. No legitimate debate there. 3) Pure politics - debatable 4) Leadership - nuanced perspective. Leadership is subjective, however, experience is not. 5) Wartime... Duh, Obama is very anti-military establishment. No debate there. 6) 2nd Amendment. Uhhh, this has been settled. It's not really an Executive branch issue beyond support of Congressional action. On pure principle of supporting the Constitution though, advantage McCain. If you don't like the 2nd Amendment, advantage Obama. 7) Liberal/ Conservative. Duh, Obama is rated by Liberal mags as the most Liberal Senator in the Senate, with an even more Liberal voting record than Kennedy. If you want to try the French experiment, advantage Obama. If not, advantage McCain. 8) Big Government. Another Duh. If you want a push for more govenment social programs, advantage Obama, if not advantage McCain. 9) Healthcare - Emergency healthcare is always available to everyone, illegal or not. Drama isn't necessary in the debate. "FREE" healthcare is NOT a right - advantage McCain, unless you believe it is. 10) Experience - I don't even think Obama tries to argue this one. His argument is "youth vs. experience". Last edited by tanfixr; 07-04-2008 at 10:34 AM.

07-04-2008, 10:36 AM	#304 (permalink)
unity I vote for DERF! Join Date: Jan 6 2004 Location: Midwest-ish Posts: 3,338 Rep Power: 6	Re: Let's argue politics ... Im just wondering what would happen when McCain dies in office, assuming he gets there. After the first term he would be near 80. So anyone pro-McCain needs to also look closely at his running mate. Its bad enough he has the first stages of alzheimer. __________________ I lost my signature, if you find it let me know please.

07-04-2008, 11:14 AM	#305 (permalink)
Don Smith Join Date: Feb 25 2000 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 1,620 Rep Power: 10	Re: Let's argue politics ... The question is, who "flip-flops" more, Obama or McCain? Neither of them have a real "core" to sustain them. Some questions for you Obama fans. Does he "stand for" what he said in the primaries or what he is now saying? Does anyone (including him) really know what he will do if he is elected? The "safer" choice (and I'll have to hold my nose if I am forced to vote for him) is McCain but the "best choice" for the country is HRC. Another question. Does anyone think that Obama would have won the primary if he had said what he is saying now?

07-04-2008, 02:39 PM	#306 (permalink)
Ezliving_Jim I love Derf!! Join Date: Mar 12 2002 Location: Virtual Reality Posts: 2,423 Rep Power: 10	Re: Let's argue politics ... There is Hope For America. If Don Smith is even considering voting for McCain, there is Hope For America. It is fantastic that everything that comes out of Obama's mouth is being recorded. Depending on who Obama is standing in front of, that will determine the position he takes on a given issue. In the last 24 hours, Obama wouldn't shut up about the Iraq War and ended up with 3 different positions. He has at least that many positions already on the 2nd Amendment. An apple has more "core" than Obama. Hope For America! __________________ ObamaNation. Sing with the children. Drink the Kool-Aid. *sui generis.* *si vis pacem, para bellum* "Even if we win, we will have just eked out a victory, and we can't govern." - Barack Obama. www.GunBanObama.com The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." - President Thomas Jefferson. Last edited by Ezliving_Jim; 07-04-2008 at 02:41 PM.

07-04-2008, 02:54 PM	#307 (permalink)
Ezliving_Jim I love Derf!! Join Date: Mar 12 2002 Location: Virtual Reality Posts: 2,423 Rep Power: 10	Re: Let's argue politics ... mr belveder, your responses to my quick 10 point pro-McCain list are so absurd, so illogical that they can't even qualify as debating points. Still, your vote counts. I hope you live in a dominate strong Blue State. Please don't move your vote to a Red State. __________________ ObamaNation. Sing with the children. Drink the Kool-Aid. *sui generis.* *si vis pacem, para bellum* "Even if we win, we will have just eked out a victory, and we can't govern." - Barack Obama. www.GunBanObama.com The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." - President Thomas Jefferson.

07-04-2008, 05:28 PM	#308 (permalink)
Don Smith Join Date: Feb 25 2000 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 1,620 Rep Power: 10	Re: Let's argue politics ... Message to Steve and Jim: Don't blame me, I voted for Gore and Kerry.

07-05-2008, 10:27 AM	#310 (permalink)
engfant FREE ENGFANTUCATION Join Date: May 20 2003 Posts: 9,436 Rep Power: 13	Re: Let's argue politics ... I'm not totally against McCain. He's 8 years late though. He's the one that should have been in charge on 9-11-01 not limpie bush. __________________ "And shut your mouth pussycat e fammi un macchiato, pronto!" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhHhXukovMU

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