Re: Gag order

Haole Mark · 07-22-2002, 04:42 AM

Don, It is often mentioned that Salons cannot "promote" the positive or healthful aspects of UV exposure. Is this FDA or FTC mandated? Also, how is a business owner made aware of these regs.? During business licensing procedures, Heath dept. inspection prior to opening or when/how? I know "ignorance of the law" is never an excuse...however it seems to me that stating medical/scientific facts... the average person would logically feel was okay if not "told" otherwise.
Also, is having reading material available the same as "promoting".
Similar to what may be found at Healthfood stores?
Mahalo, Mark

Don Smith · 07-22-2002, 12:42 PM

Mark:

Good question!

The FDA (Food and Drug Administration) and FTC (Federal Trade Commission) have "shared" responsibility for the indoor tanning industry.

The FDA is responsible for the "technical" aspects and the FTC is responsible for the "advertising" aspects.

My experience with both agencies is that FDA is FAR more responsive and fair than is the FTC. [Note: Take a look at some of the anti-tanning "comments" on the FTC website - www.ftc.gov - and you will see what I mean.]

So in answer to your question, it would be FTC who would bring "action" against you for making "health" claims about tanning EVEN IF THEY WERE SUPPORTED BY VALID, PEER-REVIWED SCIENTIFIC DATA!

Before you say that this isn't "fair" let me say that many things in life are unfair!

What we have to do is quit crying about this situation being "unfair" (and it is!) and get it changed.

A case in point. We can only say that the result of a series of tanning sessions is the development of a "cosmetic" tan and yet we, and FDA/FTC, knows (or ought to know) that the development of facultative pigmentation (better known as a "tan") is photoprotective, thermoprotective and immunoprotective. The only "tan" that is "only" cosmetic in nature is the one provided by the "fake spray" booths which, ironically, ARE NOT COVERED BY FDA/FTC!

If you are scratching your head and wondering what the **** is going on, join the wonderful, wacky world of regulations!

Don "Now You Understand Why I Am As I Am" Smith

Sheila in Minnesota · 07-22-2002, 12:58 PM

~Don... Quote:What we have to do is quit crying about this situation being "unfair" (and it is!) and get it changed.

are you advocating the ITA's use of Political Action Campaign monies to 'get it changed? or do you have a different suggestion as to how we force the FTC to stop being such biased whores?

Who does the FTC answer to???

Who is their boss????

Are their salaries paid by Taxes given by. . . . say ~ ~ me and you?????

let's open Pandora's toy chest

_________________
~ ~ CURED ~ ~[ This Message was edited by: Sheila in Minnesota on 2002-07-22 12:59 ]

solarmeter · 07-22-2002, 05:50 PM

Quote:
________________________________________ ____

~ ~ CURED ~ ~
________________________________________ ____

That reminds me.. I don't think tanning devices can ever be claimed to "cure" anything. Period. FTC or no FTC. Otherwise they would have to be re-classified as a higher class of "medical device". Regulations governing class 2, 3 etc devices are extreme, and not something the tanning industry could deal with, IMO.

However, claims of health related "benefits" and "potential health problem avoidance", supported by the appropriate journal peer reviewed studies SHOULD be allowed, again IMO.

Steve

Sheila in Minnesota · 07-23-2002, 12:58 AM

~ darling - - - a tanning bed DID cure my ills (winters in freeking minnesota) and the FTC can kiss my a$$ about me lipping off about it!!!

My other '~ ~ cured ~ ~ ' has to do with the distemper I caught during BigDog . . . .

now - - back to making the necessary changes . . . . and the facts that I still want to know who the FTC calls 'boss' . . . I am sick of dealing with clerks ~ ~ time to go to the head honchos and do a little dance.

Don Smith · 07-23-2002, 04:14 AM

Sheila:

The FDA is responsive to your questions/comments and they provide the opportunity to "interface" with them.

The FTC, on the other hand, take weeks to respond (if they bother to do so) and they make it very clear that they are anti-tanning and against the indoor tanning industry and for the dermatology community.

Dealing with them will cause you to take an occasional "nip" of the fruit of the vine!

Don "Who Thinks The FTC Sucks!" Smith

PS: But I will have a "surprise" for them soon!

Haole Mark · 07-23-2002, 05:08 AM

Don...
I've always LOVED surprises !!

When..When..?

Sheila in Minnesota · 07-28-2002, 02:02 PM

~~ sorry for the Delay my love..... been busy bugging other boards this past week

BTW - - - sorry Chunnster - - I don't like the new buttons ---look like huge suppositories ~ yaaaaooooowich!

So - - - the FDA and the FTC really only share the :F: in common...... can you enlighten me on to the 'professional resumes'' of the typical employee at the FTC?

Are we talking the "clerk is a jerk?" or somebody with a poopooload of consonants after their name - - -which still does not qualify them to tell ME how to run my business????

I suppose I could go look somewhere - - but I am a bit lazy today...... ( Quote:Dealing with them will cause you to take an occasional "nip" of the fruit of the vine! **** nothing like a 'nip' happened last nite love - - - hehehehe)

Onwards!!!

Don Smith · 07-28-2002, 03:33 PM

Shiela:

FTC is FILLED with lawyers!

Do you know why New Jersey got all of the chemical plants and New York got all of the lawyers?

New Jersey got first choice! LOL

Don

Sheila in Minnesota · 07-29-2002, 11:33 AM

Great ~ just what we need ~

As if it were not hard enough trying to educate highly educated people ~ now we are faced with trying to educate people that cannot be educated - cause they only promote the cause the paycheck determines ...

I would have to guess that working for the Federal Government as an Attorney cannot be Fun or requires alot of 'charisma'.... as a matter of fact - - I would imagine that the main requirement for the job would be simply that of a mouth piece droning out whatever the queen bee tells them to drone.

~~ I'd rather clean assweat off a bed

So ~ Don... I am assuming that you have a good and charismatic and truly UVL educated attorney in the wings somewhere????

I would pay to see the show down baby!!!

S

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07-22-2002, 04:42 AM	#1 (permalink)
Haole Mark Join Date: Mar 18 2002 Posts: 131 Rep Power: 7	Don, It is often mentioned that Salons cannot "promote" the positive or healthful aspects of UV exposure. Is this FDA or FTC mandated? Also, how is a business owner made aware of these regs.? During business licensing procedures, Heath dept. inspection prior to opening or when/how? I know "ignorance of the law" is never an excuse...however it seems to me that stating medical/scientific facts... the average person would logically feel was okay if not "told" otherwise. Also, is having reading material available the same as "promoting". Similar to what may be found at Healthfood stores? Mahalo, Mark

07-22-2002, 12:42 PM	#2 (permalink)
Don Smith Join Date: Feb 25 2000 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 1,526 Rep Power: 10	Mark: Good question! The FDA (Food and Drug Administration) and FTC (Federal Trade Commission) have "shared" responsibility for the indoor tanning industry. The FDA is responsible for the "technical" aspects and the FTC is responsible for the "advertising" aspects. My experience with both agencies is that FDA is FAR more responsive and fair than is the FTC. [Note: Take a look at some of the anti-tanning "comments" on the FTC website - www.ftc.gov - and you will see what I mean.] So in answer to your question, it would be FTC who would bring "action" against you for making "health" claims about tanning EVEN IF THEY WERE SUPPORTED BY VALID, PEER-REVIWED SCIENTIFIC DATA! Before you say that this isn't "fair" let me say that many things in life are unfair! What we have to do is quit crying about this situation being "unfair" (and it is!) and get it changed. A case in point. We can only say that the result of a series of tanning sessions is the development of a "cosmetic" tan and yet we, and FDA/FTC, knows (or ought to know) that the development of facultative pigmentation (better known as a "tan") is photoprotective, thermoprotective and immunoprotective. The only "tan" that is "only" cosmetic in nature is the one provided by the "fake spray" booths which, ironically, ARE NOT COVERED BY FDA/FTC! If you are scratching your head and wondering what the **** is going on, join the wonderful, wacky world of regulations! Don "Now You Understand Why I Am As I Am" Smith

07-22-2002, 12:58 PM	#3 (permalink)
Sheila in Minnesota Join Date: Jan 3 2002 Location: USA Posts: 1,805 Rep Power: 7	~Don... Quote:What we have to do is quit crying about this situation being "unfair" (and it is!) and get it changed. are you advocating the ITA's use of Political Action Campaign monies to 'get it changed? or do you have a different suggestion as to how we force the FTC to stop being such biased whores? Who does the FTC answer to??? Who is their boss???? Are their salaries paid by Taxes given by. . . . say ~ ~ me and you????? let's open Pandora's toy chest _________________ ~ ~ CURED ~ ~[ This Message was edited by: Sheila in Minnesota on 2002-07-22 12:59 ]

07-22-2002, 05:50 PM	#4 (permalink)
solarmeter Join Date: Nov 13 2001 Location: MI Posts: 515 Rep Power: 7	Quote: ________________________________________ ____ ~ ~ CURED ~ ~ ________________________________________ ____ That reminds me.. I don't think tanning devices can ever be claimed to "cure" anything. Period. FTC or no FTC. Otherwise they would have to be re-classified as a higher class of "medical device". Regulations governing class 2, 3 etc devices are extreme, and not something the tanning industry could deal with, IMO. However, claims of health related "benefits" and "potential health problem avoidance", supported by the appropriate journal peer reviewed studies SHOULD be allowed, again IMO. Steve

07-23-2002, 12:58 AM	#5 (permalink)
Sheila in Minnesota Join Date: Jan 3 2002 Location: USA Posts: 1,805 Rep Power: 7	~ darling - - - a tanning bed DID cure my ills (winters in freeking minnesota) and the FTC can kiss my a$$ about me lipping off about it!!! My other '~ ~ cured ~ ~ ' has to do with the distemper I caught during BigDog . . . . now - - back to making the necessary changes . . . . and the facts that I still want to know who the FTC calls 'boss' . . . I am sick of dealing with clerks ~ ~ time to go to the head honchos and do a little dance.

07-23-2002, 04:14 AM	#6 (permalink)
Don Smith Join Date: Feb 25 2000 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 1,526 Rep Power: 10	Sheila: The FDA is responsive to your questions/comments and they provide the opportunity to "interface" with them. The FTC, on the other hand, take weeks to respond (if they bother to do so) and they make it very clear that they are anti-tanning and against the indoor tanning industry and for the dermatology community. Dealing with them will cause you to take an occasional "nip" of the fruit of the vine! Don "Who Thinks The FTC Sucks!" Smith PS: But I will have a "surprise" for them soon!

07-23-2002, 05:08 AM	#7 (permalink)
Haole Mark Join Date: Mar 18 2002 Posts: 131 Rep Power: 7	Don... I've always LOVED surprises !! When..When..?

07-28-2002, 02:02 PM	#8 (permalink)
Sheila in Minnesota Join Date: Jan 3 2002 Location: USA Posts: 1,805 Rep Power: 7	~~ sorry for the Delay my love..... been busy bugging other boards this past week BTW - - - sorry Chunnster - - I don't like the new buttons ---look like huge suppositories ~ yaaaaooooowich! So - - - the FDA and the FTC really only share the :F: in common...... can you enlighten me on to the 'professional resumes'' of the typical employee at the FTC? Are we talking the "clerk is a jerk?" or somebody with a poopooload of consonants after their name - - -which still does not qualify them to tell ME how to run my business???? I suppose I could go look somewhere - - but I am a bit lazy today...... ( Quote:Dealing with them will cause you to take an occasional "nip" of the fruit of the vine! **** nothing like a 'nip' happened last nite love - - - hehehehe) Onwards!!!

07-28-2002, 03:33 PM	#9 (permalink)
Don Smith Join Date: Feb 25 2000 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 1,526 Rep Power: 10	Shiela: FTC is FILLED with lawyers! Do you know why New Jersey got all of the chemical plants and New York got all of the lawyers? New Jersey got first choice! LOL Don

07-29-2002, 11:33 AM	#10 (permalink)
Sheila in Minnesota Join Date: Jan 3 2002 Location: USA Posts: 1,805 Rep Power: 7	Great ~ just what we need ~ As if it were not hard enough trying to educate highly educated people ~ now we are faced with trying to educate people that cannot be educated - cause they only promote the cause the paycheck determines ... I would have to guess that working for the Federal Government as an Attorney cannot be Fun or requires alot of 'charisma'.... as a matter of fact - - I would imagine that the main requirement for the job would be simply that of a mouth piece droning out whatever the queen bee tells them to drone. ~~ I'd rather clean assweat off a bed So ~ Don... I am assuming that you have a good and charismatic and truly UVL educated attorney in the wings somewhere???? I would pay to see the show down baby!!! S

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